Is it any surprise that, once again, Donald Trump has denigrated military service and sacrifice, this time by degrading the meaning of the Medal of Honor, the nation’s highest award for military valor? That happened on Thursday when Trump recounted giving the Presidential Medal of Freedom to Miriam Adelson, a billionaire GOP donor, in 2018. “It’s actually much better because everyone gets the Congressional Medal of Honor,” Trump said. “They’re soldiers. They’re either in very bad shape because they’ve been hit so many times by bullets or they’re dead.” Adelson, in contrast, “she’s a healthy, beautiful woman.”
This malignant man’s words—meant to curry favor with Adelson—are part of a pattern, of course. In 2015, he attacked Sen. John McCain with these disgraceful remarks: “He’s not a war hero. He was a war hero because he was captured. I like people who weren’t captured.” In 2018, he canceled a visit to the Aisne-Marne American Cemetery in France to honor the war dead because it was raining and he didn’t want to muss his hair. It was during that trip that he reportedly said, “Why should I go to that cemetery? It’s filled with losers.” On the same trip, he called fallen soldiers “suckers” for getting killed. (While Trump later denied saying this, Gen. John Kelly, his own chief of staff, later confirmed the veracity of The Atlantic’s reporting.)
In 2019, we later learned, Trump criticized Gen. Mark Milley, his chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, for inviting a severely injured Army captain to sing “God Bless America” at Milley’s welcoming ceremony. The captain, Luis Avila, had served five combat tours, lost his leg during an IED attack in Afghanistan and suffered two heart attacks and two strokes as a result of his injuries. Trump callously told Milley on his first day: “Why do you bring people like that here? No one wants to see that, the wounded.”
How appalling was Trump’s denigration of the Medal of Honor this week? (This comes in the wake of J.D. Vance’s grotesque attacks on Tim Walz and his decision to exit the National Guard after 24 years of service.) Military recipients of the Medal of Honor are chosen for outstanding acts of valor on the battlefield. They are recommended by other military members who witness these actions that demonstrate “gallantry and intrepidity at the risk of life above and beyond the call of duty,.” In some cases, they are awarded posthumously.
Here’s what the head of the Veterans of Foreign Wars with 1.5 million members had to say about Trump’s remarks: “These asinine comments not only diminish the significance of our nation’s highest award for valor, but also crassly characterizes the sacrifices of those who have risked their lives above and beyond the call of duty.” He then doubted whether someone “who so brazenly dismisses the valor and reverence” the award symbolizes “would discharge their responsibilities to our men and women in uniform with the seriousness and discernment necessary for such a powerful position.”
VoteVets, a Democratic group representing veterans, put it more bluntly: “It isn’t just that Donald Trump doesn’t respect Veterans and their sacrifice,” the group said in a statement. “It’s that Donald Trump hates Veterans and their sacrifice, because he looks so small in comparison to them.”
In 2016, according to exit polls, 61 percent of veterans voted for Trump for president. By 2020, that support had dropped to 54 percent, with wider support from veterans aged 55 and older. According to the U.S. Census Bureau, there are more than 16 million veterans and about 1.4 million active-duty military personnel.
Will the latest attacks finally convince a majority of military members, veterans and their families to turn their backs on Trump and his contempt for them? Just this week, more than a thousand veterans and their families signed an open letter condemning the “politically motivated attacks” by Trump and Vance toward Tim Walz’s military service. They wrote that “given Donald Trump’s long record of expressing disdain for service members, veterans, and their families, it’s unsurprising that his running mate has stooped to such lows."
So what do you think? Has Trump finally sunk himself with veterans? Do his latest comments—made in public and impossible to deny even as his enablers have sought to minimize them with the usual “what he really meant”—represent a turning point? Or does he continue to benefit from the traditional support that Republicans garner from the military, deserved or not? It will be interesting to watch how the Democrats address this issue during their convention this week in Chicago.
As always, I look forward to reading your observations and the opportunity for this community to learn from each other. Please do be respectful in your remarks. Trolling will not be tolerated.
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*Photo: Gen. Mark Milley inspects the troops during an Armed Forces Farewell Tribute in his honor on Sept. 29, 2023. In his remarks, Milley said, “We don’t take an oath from a wannabe dictator.” Photo by Drew Angerer via Getty Images.
As a retired Flag Officer with over 32 years of service, I know a whole lot of Veterans whose service I cherish and honor. However, it has been my experience that at least half will make excuses like "I hate his words, but I like what he did as President." It saddens me to say it, but this latest affront to our nation's heroes will be unlikely to change that view for most. I will always honor these former colleagues... but there is no excuse for their support of man so bereft of character, and who is a threat to the Constitution we swore to defend.
I respectfully disagree. As a drafted vet myself too many years ago before and during the Berlin crisis (somebody might remember), I think a significant percentage of us will recognize that he is a rotten draft dodger whose time is up…finally and for good! We honor our fallen and it reminds us of our willingness to serve as a volunteer or when called to do so! Please redouble your efforts among family, friends and neighbors! We can do this and we shall!
Steven Beschloss:"...Tim Walz ...decision to exit the National Guard after 24 years"
...typo?...try
"...Tim Walz ...decision to exit the National Guard 4 years after retirement age to become a congressman to stop the Iraq war(aka a VIETNAM-LIKE FUBAR FALSE FLAG BY W's VP... Cheney... who was scarier and bolder than Trump but ONLY CRAZY ABOUT OIL) instead of support it"
So why isn’t the Harris / Walz campaign framing Walz as a conscientious objector (to the war in Iraq) as opposed to not referring directly to his rank as written on his DD-214?
He wasn't a conscientious objector. He deployed to Italy as part of the reserves to support the Afghan war. He would have taken deployment to Afghanistan itself had he been sent.
His retirement was directly tied to his decision to run for Congress. What is so hard about that? Is it possible for two separate things to happen at one time, even assuming he was aware that deployment was in the sir (as it must have been for a long time)?
He may have become one after his deployment. Hey…I am not the having a problem with this. Just pointing out facts that get glossed over during campaign gaslighting that take things like a DD-214 out of context as to make it seem unimportant. I have been in politics long enough to recognize political expedience.
That he was a conscientious objector! He served his country for 24 years, regardless of his personal beliefs. I’m old enough to remember conscientious objectors going to Canada to avoid the draft. The term was a slur then and among many military personnel it still is.
I’m an Army brat and am so proud of my career Army dad; I also marched against the war in Vietnam while he was stationed there. He did his country proud as did Tim Walz.
Really sorry I got into this with you The Harris/Walz campaign presented the facts about Walz’s National Guard service. It wasn’t a problem until Trump and the MAGATS made it one. Walz filed his retirement papers four months before his group was ordered overseas. That had NOTHING to do with his personal feelings. I won’t debate you on the rest. I just wonder why you asked the question to begin with.
What you are actually sorry about is that you are uncomfortable in a world that is more than being about black and white, more gray areas, which is why our partisan political system has so much success in gaslighting us. No doubt GOP are worse than DEMS, but they are both part of the same fucked up partisan political system. This is proven by the fact that all you are focused on is when his retirement packet was submitted, conveniently glossing over the rank written on his official DD-214. You and I know nothing of Walz’s personal feelings thoughts or ambitions, so quit pretending by emphasizing your convenient whataboutisms. Politics are a cruel companion, no one comes out the other side without some degree of failure in the areas of being complaisant, complacent or complicit. Not even Walz or Jimmy Carter. I know people on active duty who did not deploy to Iraq, for whatever reason. I have no problem with that either, especially since I personally think our invasion was unethical and wrong. I also know that 4 months is not some fucking magic nebulous number for a National Guard deployment timeline, and as an acting Battalion Command Sergeant Major, Walz also knows the be prepared to deploy status for his unit was at least a good 8 months to a year out as it takes an extended timeline to frame and mobilize National Guard units so they are at the same level of readiness as our active duty units. I know this as fact from my assignment as a plans and training officer at the mobilization, readiness and training command for Reserve and National Guard Units.
I want Walz to be our VEEP. We have no choice if we want to maintain a democracy. But I also hope Tim understands the difference between what is correct and what is right. Especially as he will be tested with the very gray areas of our military industrial complex support of Israel and Elon Musk’s access and support to our nations space program. As examples. I haven’t seen any weak spots for his positions in the domestic policy arena. Which, by the way, would all be for naught if Israel and Iran continues to exploit our weak foreign policy agenda and brings us into world war 3. Walz may have less than 4 months to plan for that.
Whatever you need to tell yourself to get by, I guess? But to belittle yourself down to MAGA styled name calling is the sure sign of a person with no confidence in their convictions, and that’s sad to see.
Though it is also one of the best indicators for survival of the fittest.
We can’t do anything to put off the inevitable act of dying, but we have a choice in doing it with an opened or closed consciousness. Part of that consciousness is to accept that all politicians, regardless of their party affiliation, even on the best day, are only capable of disingenuous behavior. It’s the business of politics, especially when it’s so fucking partisan and binary. Just as sure as killing is the business of an Army. Sure, killing can be justified as self defense; defending a Constitution or a set of principles and beliefs, but in the end it’s about taking life. If critical thought is a windy proposition for you, then you have my pity because even if Drumpf loses, these next upcoming years are going to be very difficult for you. Welcome to the revolution. Because what happens next in this country, and the world, is going to surprise us all.
Our veteran community makes up 18 percent of our population. Veterans are nothing more than a reflection of our society, especially when it comes to political thought. If half of this country supports the GOP or Kennedy, then this will be similarly reflected in the veteran community. Ask Flynn, West and Gallagher.
We’ve never—ever—seen or heard of a candidate for President who disrespects our veteran community—and our fallen—as this evil moron! Never!! I cannot believe the majority of our fellow vets will simply fall in
History tells us your thesis about the veteran community not being disrespected at unseemly levels would not go over very well with World War I veterans in 1932, who protested in Washington, D.C. to demand early payment of their promised "Tombstone Bonus". The bonus was promised to veterans in 1924, but the Great Depression made it clear that it wouldn't be paid until 1945. Please read history to see the violence that took place, including the use of tear gas and bayonets…on veterans, in our Capitol.
How about all of the black folks (like my grandfather) who fought in WW II not receiving equal consideration for veteran compensation, especially for housing and education? That sounds pretty fucking disrespectful to me.
These are unusual times indeed, where a continued coup d’etat started on 6 January 2021 and continues to this day through the planed implementation of Project 2025. Bur it’s a disingenuous precedent to believe what you want to hear, not what you need to hear, about disrespect to veterans. Merica, throughout its turbulent history, can most definitely be a cruel host.
Like everything else in this 2024 campaign, presently, we are at a tie. This includes veterans in support of their preferred political party candidates.
Below is the most recent survey I could find. Please feel free to share your survey instead of denying what the messenger delivers, or wearing rose colored glasses. Respect the fact that our military leaps bounds and barriers to forge the type of relationships not found in the civilian world because our lives depend on it. But once we depart that monastic enclave and return “home”, a different book is opened as a new phase in life…or back to a life which was vastly different than one lived in the military. Tolerance
may not have that same applicability when Johnny comes marching home.
“In a survey of our membership conducted earlier this summer, more than 88% of IAVA veteran members expressed that they would be voting in the upcoming election, but an incredible 43.7% of those aren’t ready to make up their minds until they see the final candidates. Only 27.3% are sure that they will support the Democrat in the general election and 24.3% will support the Republican.”
line with his admirers? Draft-dodger Dump’s dismissal of us as “suckers” and “losers” deserves our rejection of him plain and simple! Please pass it on!
Irv, in graduate school I was friends with the sister of Paul Bucha, the Congressional Medal of Honor awardee from the Vietnam War who died recently of Alzheimer’s disease. If anyone wants to know the courage and valor of Paul Bucha you can go to the internet and read the citation for his Congressional Medal of Honor. Once again, Traitor Trump showed his disdain for our brave soldiers by telling everyone yesterday that the Presidential Medal of Freedom was more important than the Congressional Medal of Honor!!!
Please, it is the Presidential Metal of Honor rather than the Congressional MOH. Thank you for reminding all of us of those who served in the Vietnam War. My husband also lost friends from grad school during that era. We must never forget the total horror of war or degrade those who serve.
It's actually not the "Presidential Medal of Honor" as the sitting president doesn't pick the recipients, rather, it is Congress. So those recipients are actual worthy of the medal and not a pandering president wanting cash. I would think you would know the difference.
It's time to let those friends know, in no uncertain terms, that "What he did as President" and plans to do in the future is to destroy ALL that they risked their lives for. Say it politely, but tell them.
Amen. Fox "news" is on TV in many, most? Military bases, at least from what has been reported. If you are 18-22 and getting a regular dose of propaganda and have not read or seen any factual information. Then of course that and peer pressure may form their polical opinions. The excuse for anyone older is rather pathetic but filled with the BS that the likes of Kirk and Bannon produced. Bannon even admitted as much prior to Trump taking office, that they were following Hitlers playbook.
Ignorance, racism and greed of the GOP donor class appears to be the result. How long has The Heritage Foundation been at it, even prior to Project 2024?
Actually younger veterans and enlisted service members favored Biden in the last election at 41% to trump’s 37%. It is the 55 and older folks which stayed with trump (52%, down from 62% in 2016).
What’s so sad is he did absolutely nothing for anyone with any connection to the military, active or veteran. He did manage to screw with the VA by installing 3 of his mal a lardo friends though. I’m afraid De Nile is deep in the forces I fear.
As a veteran, Don-old Drumpf’s vitriolic and narcissistic ignorance no longer angers me. It heightens my hyper vigilance to the degree needed in order to see he is only emblematic of too many amongst us unable to understand what selfless service is about. It’s sad…sad in a way where I am grateful more of my years are behind me than ahead of me.
The current Repugnant Party is a cancerous lesion on our Democracy. A Minority of leaders are morons...the rest cowards to yellow to stand up for what's right. Which is worse????
I am a Goldstar family and I can tell you that a lot of viewers of Fox News have no idea that Trump has said one nasty word about the military. And they certainly do not believe me when I try and explain to them all the different things that he has said over the years. I even point out the different voting records of Republicans in the House and the Senate, but again this is not a well-informed population I think due to their viewing habits. Just my take on things.
Correct, I went to FoxNews.com and of course there is nothing on the site about Donny Dumpʻs comment. Time to buy up air time in cities and towns with military bases and roll the tape.
Some day there will be a reckoning for the damage Fox News has inflicted on this country by enabling and promoting Trump. An $800 million defamation settlement apparently was not nearly enough.
We can only hope. Fox News had the attention of too many Americans. It is responsible for the dumbing down of this Country. Misinformation needs to go away.
Fox News has and had the attention of too many of our citizens. It is past the time for the citizens of this country to demand that Congress update and reinstate the media's Fairness Doctrine.
Why don't we have a class action lawsuit against Fox News for destroying our country? I guess it's not gonna do anything until we just assign a dollar value to our loss democracy then maybe they will listen to us? A girl can dream. They are destroying our country, every day.
What you need to do, what Adam a GenZer, (he has a YT page, IG, Twitter, TikTok, Discord, Subreddit) does, at Trump rallies when talking to supporters, show them clips of DonOldJTrump saying these things. Some have had no comment, others “I didn’t know that”. Video visuals help. Of course, there will be those that say, it’s AI, or fake. But at least they’ve seen it.
Yeah, sure, ok. Maybe so, but it goes way deeper than what they see and hear on tv or the internet. They probably have no idea how the government works or think because he says it, it must be true without any evidence. It’s what Stanley Milgram wanted to find out in his “Obedience to Authority” study. He wanted to know why people did or believed what Hitler said. They did because they did. It’s why we tap our brakes when we’re driving and see a black and white in the vicinity. It’s hard for me to break it down without sounding like I’m rambling. Basically, we believe in some persons in positions of power and once we’re emotionally involved, we can’t be told otherwise. Also, the Stanford Prison experiment or Stockholm Syndrome. It’s tough for some to break away from their beliefs, no matter how harmful those beliefs may be to either themselves, their loved ones or society at large, even when presented with cold, hard facts or scientific evidence. Please try not to judge ME by what I’m saying. I’m simply trying to explain why some people love the Mango Mussolini and believe every word he says. I’m not one of them. I’m also a veteran and I was with Hillary when she said he and his cronies are deplorables.
I remember when he disparaged John McCain for being captured. Later at one of his rallies a reporter interviewed attendees including ones wearing caps or other indications of military service. They didn’t care. A couple laughed it off. One said McCain had done the wrong thing (ACA thumbs down). I knew we were in trouble then, 2015.
I think it is partly not wanting to know & being stuck in their ways. Younger veterans and enlisted service members think differently than those 55 and older. In 2016 veterans favored trump (60%-34%). In October 2020 it was 52%-42%. Enlisted service members leaned toward Biden.
I’m a member of VoteVets and financially support their efforts. Rachel Madow has aired some of their anti trump commercials. Cadet Bone Spurs is and has always been a disgrace and should NEVER be C in C again. We were lucky enough to make it through four years, let’s not press our collective luck with more!
I grew up in a military family. My father and his brothers were military. My mother's father and her brother were military. I lived near military bases My entire life. I was taught to love this country.
My father in law was a retired Navy Captain. When he passed away, he had a military funeral.
Everything I have ever heard about Trump disgusts me. I don't know how anyone who knows anything about the military could ever vote for him.
There are many more that have your back. Keep spreading your story Teresa! There's an army out here doing more than you know, because we recognize the sacrifice of people like your family.
This U.S. Army veteran will proudly cast my vote for Kamala Harris, Tim Walz and all D candidates up and down ballot in this election. Cadet bone spurs, Shady Vance , Mike Johnson and all the other election deniers are the biggest threat to our democracy. FWIW - former R (until RayGun) turned I and now solid D. Time to save America and the middle class. Vote BLUE.
Indeed, so many voters are effectively shielded from earth-based reality by relying on Fox and sympathetic FB and X screed, believing that to leave that bubble they’ll be infected by actual facts.
Sadly, I think this is going to be the military equivalent of "I could shoot someone on 5th Avenue..."
If the McCain comments, the belittling and harassment of the Kahn Gold Star family, and saying "what was in it for them" at the grave site of John Kelly's son, in Kelly's presence didn't do it, this won't either. Salute to all veterans and most especially the recipients of the Medal of Honor, and all awards for heroism.
I heard what former President Trump said yesterday on the news. I sat stunned on the sofa for quite a while. His words about our Vets cast a continuing theme over the years. He is a very damaged unwell man who should never return to the White House under any circumstances.
He should never have been allowed to go free. J6 he should have been arrested and charged with insurrection and treason as well as being responsible for lives lost that day. LIFE IN PRISON
If members of the military, active duty or veterans, pay attention, they should notice that republicans actively fight against legislation that would help them.
WE are paying attention and WE have the power to change this, even if we are the underpower civilians. A simple disagree at a party, which I was at last night and they were questioning Kamala's "DEI" hire. And I couldn't stay quiet. No drama, just a couple facts, and then I walked away. Mustard seeds go farther than we think.
Easier said than done when raised and living in the monastic enclave of an “Apolitical” environment - which is exactly what our armed forces are. More of a concern is why the MAGA base rally attendees don’t see this? Veterans over all only comprise 18% of our population. One percent of our population serves on active duty…mostly in red states. And with the rapid operational tempo of fighting the forever wars and “conflicts” chosen by our legislators and taxpayers, little time remains to really understand any political parties agenda.
If he hasn't, then I can't comprehend what the heck is going on with Veterans in the U.S. BTW, I will always remember General Milley's comment to Michelle Obama at President Biden's swearing it. She said something to the effect that, "I'll bet you're glad that's over." He said, "You have no idea." Also, do I remember correctly that during this "campaign", the orange sadist called for the execution of Gen. Milley for being a traitor?
I am eternally grateful to General Milley for all he had to endure on our behalf! Without vets like him, Esper, etc., remaining in their trump admin assignments trying to contain a clueless maniac, I’m not sure where we’d all be today! Putin’s troops might have been invited to take over some of our military bases because, you know, “there’s fine people on both sides!”
I can't agree with you more! Do you remember how, after the orange sadist lost the election, Gen. Milley as Head of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, sat the others down and said, "You take your orders from ME, now. If you get an order from the President, run it by me first." Astounding! And, as you say, he probably (sounds extreme, but I believe it) saved us from a nuclear war. Apparently when a war starts, often the President stays in power at the beginning.
Of thanks for that reminder! Absolutely nauseating that such a fool was ever elected president and unbelievable what his staff had to endure. Wish General Milley was still in service but he definitely deserved to retire!
I was probably too big of a fan lol. Used to tell my son to track Gen Milley down at the Army/Navy games to get a photo with him, but it never happened. Maybe one day?
Right. That's why accused criminal Netanyahu won't stop the war in Gaza, no matter how many children, women, doctors, and innocents are killed, wounded or starved. We would get ourselves the same thing if we allow the orange creature back into the WH
On Nov 6th 2020 he claimed that all votes received and counted after election day were illegal. That INCLUDED military votes that came in from overseas.
He doesn't not only give a shit about the military he has denigrated them for decades.
He likes the parades, the uniforms, the tanks and the weapons. The violence of war feeds his sadism.
He is the most loathsome creature on the planet.
If they keep voting for him at this point especially all I can say is they not only shame themselves but the entire country they profess to love and be willing to sacrifice their lives for.
👏⭐️ Wow! Some really great viewpoints on this thread. Harris/Walz needs to hire many of you to aid their campaign!! There should be commercial and billboards with quotes like this:
“He likes the parades, the uniforms, the tanks and the weapons.
You’re right, these statements are mostly unscripted stream of consciousness and tangential thinking. The man is clearly on the throes of dementia. He is nearly unable to make plans, carry out plans, change plans when circumstances change, or control his emotions to accomplish his goals. His prefrontal cortex is overshadowed by his amygdala- fear and anger, fight/flight/freeze. It’s horrific to think he could have almost total immunity when he is functioning like a toddler
“It’s that Donald Trump hates Veterans and their sacrifice, because he looks so small in comparison to them.” This says it all. Veterans who still support the candidate on the right needs to wake up. Read Project 2025 regarding veteran benefits and health care.
Veterans are another part of the fabric that makes America. We were all civilians when we went into the military, and even the lifers come out as civilians again. I do not believe we vote as a block - it's just another demographic. So many vets, especially from the Vietnam era, were drafted, and most of them were drafted from the same demographic - lower middle class - which is the MAGA base, so many vets will continue to support the MAGA agenda. The important thing is that most Americans understand the difference between a Medal of Honor winner and little donny, so I would say that most Americans are really increasingly sickened by this idiot and his spawn, which includes JD.
Who knows? His support from the “law and order” folks never made sense, except for the fact that there must be so many in that community who are also sociopathic.
I wish I did. It was during one of my seminars during my fourth (out of five) year of residency. The professor who gave the lecture was studying CT scans of sociopaths versus normal people. He had done a lot of research in the area, and I guess was reporting on his (and those of researchers in other major institutions) findings. This was ages ago -- as in 35+ years ago -- so I don't know if these findings would still be valid as of 2024. I also recall that there was a fascinating finding that sociopathy appeared to be genetic to some degree. I've always thought that that fits exactly with the drumpf generations: his PGF, his father, himself, and his sons. (Grandchildren's personalities/personality disorders are yet to be seen.)
kd - a friend of mine, who's done a lot of tech work for local police stations over the last few decades, calls it, "cop mentality." He says he can spot it a mile away. This friend knew my father-in-law, who was a patrolman for 25 years (his not-so-secret drinking prevented any promotions), and said FIL was a perfect example. All I can say is, FIL was a total piece of work. I never wanted to be anywhere around him.
Medal of Honor recipients, all military members, present and past, should know a grateful nation honors each and every one of you. A little, little man cannot tarnish our respect for you.
I wonder why Vance “retired” from the USMC? He’s been complaining about Tim Walz’ service, calling his “early” exit from the National Reserve almost an act of cowardice. The reserved armed forces of all of the branches is the backbone of our military forces. They’re ready to provide support wherever needed and constantly train to do so. How long did Vance serve? Why did he join in the first place? And what were his motives? The two people heading the Republican ticket have disgraced themselves with the military community, both active and retired, and there’s no reason to believe they’ll stop doing this. Trump cannot stop himself. Vance doesn’t want to!
I don’t know why any veteran ever would ever have voted for Donnie Convict, but if anyone still does at this point, I submit they need professional help, fast. There is just no excuse after the bone spurs, all the denigrating comments, and the promise to basically turn the military into his own personal police force. Anybody who can rationalize all that is losing his grip on reality.
Really? This guy for commander-in-chief? This loathsome, psychopathic narcissist who sees everything on the transactional basis of how it can best serve him? This horrible specimen of humanity who pours scorn on men of honor while sucking up to fascists? The idea is so laughably absurd that in a sane world it would be beyond imagination. But here we are: this is the world we live in.
But where are the generals who served in the White House with this monster? We need Milley, Mattis and Kelly to step forward together to denounce this traitor in the clearest terms.
Dear Generals, if you mean to uphold the oaths you took to our Constitution, it is your duty to speak up now in order to save our nation from an unmitigated disaster that would have the gravest consequences for the whole world, and for generations to come. Or would you rather be complicit?
Exactly, Steven. It's one thing for them to voice their frustrations separately and, as they have tended to do, in terms that are somewhat oblique to the immediate danger at hand. Here, for example, are General Milley's words during his farewell speech: "We don’t take an oath to an individual. We take an oath to the Constitution, and we take an oath to the idea that is America, and we’re willing to die to protect it."
As you say, they need to speak up now in a combined and focused way to denounce Trump in clear and unvarnished terms. They need to do so in plain words that even the most diehard of MAGA cultists will understand.
There are groups of retired Flags that are speaking out and are actively working to support the Harris candidacy. You will be seeing more of us as the campaign moves forward.
General, The military man we most need to step forward is John Kelly. Not denying a report in The Atlantic about what Trump said about soldiers who gave their lives is NOT enough. By not speaking out, Kelly is allowing voters to put that guy back in the WH despite how dangerous he KNOWS trump is. If your group can sway Kelly to do what's right, it would carry a lot of weight in the eyes of the public.
Thank you! Also realize that project 2025 calls for the military to swear allegiance to the president, not the constitution. The military currently can disobey an order that is against the constitution, but that wouldn’t be true under project 2025.
My dear friend was a Vietnam veteran and died a painful death several years ago from Agent Orange related cancer. I donate to several veterans’ organizations and I have great respect for our veterans: several of my college classmates were drafted. I don’t know how the right wing will respond to Trump’s latest atrocious assault on our veterans, but I hope ALL veterans realize he has no respect for their service and is an abhorrent individual who should never serve as Commander in Chief.
I doubt trumps support from the military and vets will drop too much. The older Vets, may finally have heard enough. But as we’ve seen, if the are in the cult of Trump, they’ll find an excuse to dismiss his cowardly and appalling remarks.
It sickens me every time I hear what comes out of donOLD's mouth, but when he denigrates our Veterans, that's the last straw. This man is not fit to be President or hold ANY seat in Government, business or any position of power. He needs to punished for all the harm he's done to the American people and the World. Excellent piece today,Steven, Thank You 💯💙🇺🇸
USAF, 1965-1969. Trump lost me at the bone spurs. And every other denigration of the military and wounded vets since. This just makes me loath him even more.
Nothing new. Fox is a perpetrator of abuse against elders and those who easily buy into their narrative. Foxers don't trust anyone but Fox, so they aren't seeking out information. As my ever gullible brother told me - Google suppresses the truth and Fox keeps them informed. My family members who buy into the Fox narrative are either old, extremely gullible or delusional.
I once told a Trumper about the “suckers and losers” statement and he told me it was lie made up by the mainstream media. Theyve been brainwashed to not believe anything except Fox so there’s no way you reason with them. They’ll never see the horrible things Trump has said about the military from Fox..
I was a military wife for all of my adult years until the death of my husband. He died due to service on submarines. I am fighting for all military families when I spread the word about Trump! We must not let him EVER be commander in chief!
I am amazed Trump wins so many veterans' votes. I certainly hope his continued denigration of veterans, especially those who gave their all, will finally persuade veteran voters and their families that Trump is unfit to be commander in chief. This latest incident in which he tried to elevate a woman who's done nothing to deserve any medal, above actual heroes only makes his conduct that much more deplorable.
It's true that Fox News is by far the biggest proselytizer of the MAGA cult religion. And it's true that it is the mind and heart junk food of many who rarely dip into any true news to feed their minds. But I have to ask, even so, where is the mainstream media on reporting this? Why are they not supporting veterans and all the troops? You would think reporting these outrageous and sickening Trump comments as per the latest example, and exploring it journalistically, would get clicks and generate income (since that matters so much more than journalism in today's business model). Why are they essentially silent? It is beyond comprehension to me that those who have served would support the bone spurs draft dodger. (After 24 years, Tim Walz had every right to retire whenever he chose. Ironically, to continue his public service even til now. His length of military duty is the exception not the rule.)
The extent to which Americans have gone to support their patron saint of self-righteous anger, cunning and deceit is at times stomach turning and mind boggling.
I’m not an American but I have stood on the deck of the USS Arizona memorial and wept, watching the oil still seep up from the ship beneath the water. I have been to that poignant cemetery at Omaha Beach three times and each time I feel the emotional weight of the thousands buried there and the honour and respect shown by visitors.
Trump's comments are outrageous, especially for someone who held the office of Commander-in-Chief.
It is customary to salute the holders of the Congressional Medal of Honor. It is not lightly won. Trump's actions and statements are no salute to those who wear the medal, and those who gave their lives in service of their nation.
America's servicemen and women have a proud heritage and we in the Western world value their efforts and devotion to duty.
We are a country of Red, White, and Blue! We are proud of our grandfather's, brothers and countryman who served! We have parades for them. Light off firecrackers and have fun family get-together! Of course, Donald hates this. He's not the center of attention and it reminds him he's a coward. It also reminds him of all the hurtful remarks he's made about the real American heros. Also, disrespectful J.D. has the makes disparaging remarks about another veteran. How respectful is that character?
Donald Trump is a gutless coward who avoided military service by obtaining a false medical report that claimed he had bone spurs. He is a weak, thin skinned, fear oriented bully who wants to become a fascist dictator. He is a national disgrace and an international embarrassment who attempted a coup on Jan. 6, 2021, and refused to return Top Secret documents from his home in Florida. He also attempted to overthrow the results of the presidential election in Georgia. He has no respect for the rule of law, the Constitution or The Bill of Rights, and deserves to be in a federal prison for the heinous crimes he has committed against this country. As an 85 year old honorably discharged U. S. Navy veteran of the Vietnam Era, I cannot imagine why any active duty or military veteran would vote for this very sick and dangerous individual. After Trump loses the election on Nov. 5th, the new Harris/Walz administration needs to quickly move forward with prosecuting, convicting and sentencing this THUG to a Federal prison where he should remain for the rest of his life. Trump is nothing but a treasonous traitor!
Convict Trump's remarks about the Medal of Honor were truly reprehensible. Whether it is military veterans, civil servants of any type or virtually anyone else, he does not understand the concept of country above self. He doesn't understand that the classified documents in his bathroom were obtained through someone else's sacrifice. It means nothing to him. He is not running to serve his country. He is running to enrich himself and to stay out of prison. Sadly, I don't think the MAGA cult cares. If it mattered, a convicted felon would not be on the ballot.
This latest comment won't change a thing with the MAGA Veterans, just like p****y grabbing did nothing to erode the MAGA "Christians" support for Trump.
Lord, I hope so. Nothing is more abominable than anyone denigrating our Servicemen & women. Stuck in the 70--80s (his ties, suits etc0, ole burn spurs needs to find a hole and crawl in. I have said it before, we must turn-out and vote in numbers so large there is NO question about the outcome. Steven, thanks for letting us vent.
Trump has continually been going down from a moral standing point of view from even before his presidency and is still going down and there seems to be no bottom in sight yes. The main surprise is that the MSM, the GOP and a lot of Americans, keep on following him in his downward spiral by lowering their own standing This no doubt will have a longer-term impact on the moral standing of the US as a country.
I think those who support Trump will support him no matter what. I live in a 55+ community. Every Friday my neighbor hosts a “men’s attitude adjustment” gathering and all the attendees are veterans. The oldest among the group is so diehard a trumper that nothing, not even this most-recent despicable bit, will change his mind. It’s unfortunate that their disdain for more-liberal minded folks has blinded them to the reality of Trump (unless they, too, are utterly vile humans).
I've listened and read literally thousands of posts of vets, from my era ('Nam) all the way to today. And I'm still gobsmacked that ANY veteran who took the oath to protect and defend the Constitution would vote for Trump or any MAGA candidate. The reasons are long, but really., why would you vote for:
-- a draft-dodger?
-- someone who disrespects vets -- esp. those that get killed or "hit with bullets." Are you ephing kidding me?
--someone who doesn't understand the military and doesn't want to learn. THIS is the guy you want as you CiC?
--someone who doesn't understand or respect the Constitution?
--someone who couldn't be bothered to go to the Normandy beaches and cemetery to honor the brave men and women (incl. my uncle) who made the ultimate sacrifice?
--someone who only gives orders to please or benefit himself?
--someone who loves and cherishes his relationships with people who would be (or actually are) our enemies?
If you vote for Trump or MAGA -- even if the MAGA candidate running was a vet him or herself -- then you've lost your way and your credibility...just like those MAGA vets.
We already know he's an asshole. Now, would you mind writing about the bribe Egypt paid him just before he took office? The corruption is just breathtaking yet you, like the rest of the news media, focus on his stupidity instead of his criminal acts.
It is hard for me to see how any veteran could support this man who has time and time again mocked and disrespected these people.His evading military service to Viet Nam because of imaginary “ bone spurs” because he was wealthy enough to $ get a doctor $ to exempt his service is a cowards way out.I will continue to be be perplexed at veterans who support him as well as women,people of color,and other groups that he has belittled and mocked and continues to do so to this day.
I think veterans who saw battle and are thinking people, understand what a repugnant jerk Trump actually is. I think all military who take their jobs seriously and understand their role in relation to this country understand Trump is undeserving and should never have been president and should be prevented from being so ever again. Like every class of Americans though, there are people who were in service and are in service who see that service differently. Maybe they like the machismo (men and women by the way) or who were incapable of seeing the people in countries who suffered massively because of the US thirst for war as less than human. Everyone knows folks like this. Sadistic, violent, no regard for the humanity of others that they can overpower. Those vets stay with trump because they are wired the same way. They were wired that way before going into the armed forces. They never had honorable intent. Military service doesn't by itself make someone a hero or worthy of the statement "thanks for your service." Those folks....they won't be like Milly who stands in the way of a trump who will brazenly use the military for his own autocratic putinesque ends. Trump is counting on it and that is who he is signaling to. A dictator needs a military comprised of monsters.
I saw an interview with retired General McCaffrey on Deadline Whitehouse. He stated that even with everything that has happened, there’s still a certain percentage of the military who support trump - which I find completely baffling. And Sad! They haven’t just overlooked one thing he’s said or done, but multiple things. 🙄
I great he gives the richest foreign woman in Earth a praise or award for keeping more vulnerable Americans strung out on a drug worse than heroin ,a drug she makes more money off of ,keeping them in poverty housing and on food stamps instead of rehabilitating them. Their families only receive the help if they stay in the state ran programs making her richer ,the state richer and the poor families watch as their lived ones slowly die from organ failure ...methadone numbs the organs . Over time the anus protrudes until eventually they have to start removing it or they can't sit . Their tongues swell up until they can't talk... They would have been way better off had they continued with heroin . And yet , give the witch a medal as she oversees more and more American families in disrepair. For the money she gets the family should use it for rehabilitation and treatment . Not her dysfunctional drug
Sadly, it doesn’t seem to change their minds. I posted about this latest insult on my high school friend’s page. I got an indignant response from one of her friends who defended him and said that I need to stop getting my news from CNN (as if!). She said she and her whole military family were ardent supporters and insisted that “most military” do support him. I then pointed out that she was incorrect and that many do not. Later my friend found an article that defended bone spur deferments as very common (yeah, I guess they were, if your dad could afford them). Nope, some are just in too deep. Yet I am heartened to read the numbers have gone down some.
As a retired Flag Officer with over 32 years of service, I know a whole lot of Veterans whose service I cherish and honor. However, it has been my experience that at least half will make excuses like "I hate his words, but I like what he did as President." It saddens me to say it, but this latest affront to our nation's heroes will be unlikely to change that view for most. I will always honor these former colleagues... but there is no excuse for their support of man so bereft of character, and who is a threat to the Constitution we swore to defend.
I respectfully disagree. As a drafted vet myself too many years ago before and during the Berlin crisis (somebody might remember), I think a significant percentage of us will recognize that he is a rotten draft dodger whose time is up…finally and for good! We honor our fallen and it reminds us of our willingness to serve as a volunteer or when called to do so! Please redouble your efforts among family, friends and neighbors! We can do this and we shall!
Steven Beschloss:"...Tim Walz ...decision to exit the National Guard after 24 years"
...typo?...try
"...Tim Walz ...decision to exit the National Guard 4 years after retirement age to become a congressman to stop the Iraq war(aka a VIETNAM-LIKE FUBAR FALSE FLAG BY W's VP... Cheney... who was scarier and bolder than Trump but ONLY CRAZY ABOUT OIL) instead of support it"
So why isn’t the Harris / Walz campaign framing Walz as a conscientious objector (to the war in Iraq) as opposed to not referring directly to his rank as written on his DD-214?
He wasn't a conscientious objector. He deployed to Italy as part of the reserves to support the Afghan war. He would have taken deployment to Afghanistan itself had he been sent.
His retirement was directly tied to his decision to run for Congress. What is so hard about that? Is it possible for two separate things to happen at one time, even assuming he was aware that deployment was in the sir (as it must have been for a long time)?
He may have become one after his deployment. Hey…I am not the having a problem with this. Just pointing out facts that get glossed over during campaign gaslighting that take things like a DD-214 out of context as to make it seem unimportant. I have been in politics long enough to recognize political expedience.
Shame on you for even suggesting that! !
Suggesting what?
That he was a conscientious objector! He served his country for 24 years, regardless of his personal beliefs. I’m old enough to remember conscientious objectors going to Canada to avoid the draft. The term was a slur then and among many military personnel it still is.
I’m an Army brat and am so proud of my career Army dad; I also marched against the war in Vietnam while he was stationed there. He did his country proud as did Tim Walz.
Really sorry I got into this with you The Harris/Walz campaign presented the facts about Walz’s National Guard service. It wasn’t a problem until Trump and the MAGATS made it one. Walz filed his retirement papers four months before his group was ordered overseas. That had NOTHING to do with his personal feelings. I won’t debate you on the rest. I just wonder why you asked the question to begin with.
What you are actually sorry about is that you are uncomfortable in a world that is more than being about black and white, more gray areas, which is why our partisan political system has so much success in gaslighting us. No doubt GOP are worse than DEMS, but they are both part of the same fucked up partisan political system. This is proven by the fact that all you are focused on is when his retirement packet was submitted, conveniently glossing over the rank written on his official DD-214. You and I know nothing of Walz’s personal feelings thoughts or ambitions, so quit pretending by emphasizing your convenient whataboutisms. Politics are a cruel companion, no one comes out the other side without some degree of failure in the areas of being complaisant, complacent or complicit. Not even Walz or Jimmy Carter. I know people on active duty who did not deploy to Iraq, for whatever reason. I have no problem with that either, especially since I personally think our invasion was unethical and wrong. I also know that 4 months is not some fucking magic nebulous number for a National Guard deployment timeline, and as an acting Battalion Command Sergeant Major, Walz also knows the be prepared to deploy status for his unit was at least a good 8 months to a year out as it takes an extended timeline to frame and mobilize National Guard units so they are at the same level of readiness as our active duty units. I know this as fact from my assignment as a plans and training officer at the mobilization, readiness and training command for Reserve and National Guard Units.
I want Walz to be our VEEP. We have no choice if we want to maintain a democracy. But I also hope Tim understands the difference between what is correct and what is right. Especially as he will be tested with the very gray areas of our military industrial complex support of Israel and Elon Musk’s access and support to our nations space program. As examples. I haven’t seen any weak spots for his positions in the domestic policy arena. Which, by the way, would all be for naught if Israel and Iran continues to exploit our weak foreign policy agenda and brings us into world war 3. Walz may have less than 4 months to plan for that.
Umm no you big wind bag!
🤣🤣
Whatever you need to tell yourself to get by, I guess? But to belittle yourself down to MAGA styled name calling is the sure sign of a person with no confidence in their convictions, and that’s sad to see.
Though it is also one of the best indicators for survival of the fittest.
We can’t do anything to put off the inevitable act of dying, but we have a choice in doing it with an opened or closed consciousness. Part of that consciousness is to accept that all politicians, regardless of their party affiliation, even on the best day, are only capable of disingenuous behavior. It’s the business of politics, especially when it’s so fucking partisan and binary. Just as sure as killing is the business of an Army. Sure, killing can be justified as self defense; defending a Constitution or a set of principles and beliefs, but in the end it’s about taking life. If critical thought is a windy proposition for you, then you have my pity because even if Drumpf loses, these next upcoming years are going to be very difficult for you. Welcome to the revolution. Because what happens next in this country, and the world, is going to surprise us all.
Good to hear, Ira!
I really admire your daily hard work and keeping it lively as well as informative! Thanks Steven; we appreciate you!
Our veteran community makes up 18 percent of our population. Veterans are nothing more than a reflection of our society, especially when it comes to political thought. If half of this country supports the GOP or Kennedy, then this will be similarly reflected in the veteran community. Ask Flynn, West and Gallagher.
We’ve never—ever—seen or heard of a candidate for President who disrespects our veteran community—and our fallen—as this evil moron! Never!! I cannot believe the majority of our fellow vets will simply fall in
History tells us your thesis about the veteran community not being disrespected at unseemly levels would not go over very well with World War I veterans in 1932, who protested in Washington, D.C. to demand early payment of their promised "Tombstone Bonus". The bonus was promised to veterans in 1924, but the Great Depression made it clear that it wouldn't be paid until 1945. Please read history to see the violence that took place, including the use of tear gas and bayonets…on veterans, in our Capitol.
How about all of the black folks (like my grandfather) who fought in WW II not receiving equal consideration for veteran compensation, especially for housing and education? That sounds pretty fucking disrespectful to me.
These are unusual times indeed, where a continued coup d’etat started on 6 January 2021 and continues to this day through the planed implementation of Project 2025. Bur it’s a disingenuous precedent to believe what you want to hear, not what you need to hear, about disrespect to veterans. Merica, throughout its turbulent history, can most definitely be a cruel host.
Like everything else in this 2024 campaign, presently, we are at a tie. This includes veterans in support of their preferred political party candidates.
Below is the most recent survey I could find. Please feel free to share your survey instead of denying what the messenger delivers, or wearing rose colored glasses. Respect the fact that our military leaps bounds and barriers to forge the type of relationships not found in the civilian world because our lives depend on it. But once we depart that monastic enclave and return “home”, a different book is opened as a new phase in life…or back to a life which was vastly different than one lived in the military. Tolerance
may not have that same applicability when Johnny comes marching home.
https://iava.org/press_releases/as-2024-presidential-election-heats-up-veteran-vote-is-a-jump-ball/
“In a survey of our membership conducted earlier this summer, more than 88% of IAVA veteran members expressed that they would be voting in the upcoming election, but an incredible 43.7% of those aren’t ready to make up their minds until they see the final candidates. Only 27.3% are sure that they will support the Democrat in the general election and 24.3% will support the Republican.”
#VoteAgainstProject2025
line with his admirers? Draft-dodger Dump’s dismissal of us as “suckers” and “losers” deserves our rejection of him plain and simple! Please pass it on!
Let's collaborate?
My response to "I hate his words, but I like what he did as President," would be, Really. I HATE what he did as President, and here's my list ...
Irv, in graduate school I was friends with the sister of Paul Bucha, the Congressional Medal of Honor awardee from the Vietnam War who died recently of Alzheimer’s disease. If anyone wants to know the courage and valor of Paul Bucha you can go to the internet and read the citation for his Congressional Medal of Honor. Once again, Traitor Trump showed his disdain for our brave soldiers by telling everyone yesterday that the Presidential Medal of Freedom was more important than the Congressional Medal of Honor!!!
Please, it is the Presidential Metal of Honor rather than the Congressional MOH. Thank you for reminding all of us of those who served in the Vietnam War. My husband also lost friends from grad school during that era. We must never forget the total horror of war or degrade those who serve.
It's actually not the "Presidential Medal of Honor" as the sitting president doesn't pick the recipients, rather, it is Congress. So those recipients are actual worthy of the medal and not a pandering president wanting cash. I would think you would know the difference.
Holly smokes! Medal of Honor. Typo🥹
When I saw that you said "metal," I heard the error as the word "mettle," which would actually work. 😝
Drives me nuts when people call the MOH the "Cong....al"
But that is the official name… by law…
It's time to let those friends know, in no uncertain terms, that "What he did as President" and plans to do in the future is to destroy ALL that they risked their lives for. Say it politely, but tell them.
Amen. Fox "news" is on TV in many, most? Military bases, at least from what has been reported. If you are 18-22 and getting a regular dose of propaganda and have not read or seen any factual information. Then of course that and peer pressure may form their polical opinions. The excuse for anyone older is rather pathetic but filled with the BS that the likes of Kirk and Bannon produced. Bannon even admitted as much prior to Trump taking office, that they were following Hitlers playbook.
Ignorance, racism and greed of the GOP donor class appears to be the result. How long has The Heritage Foundation been at it, even prior to Project 2024?
Heritage? They were at it with Ronnie Raygun. Well before.
Actually younger veterans and enlisted service members favored Biden in the last election at 41% to trump’s 37%. It is the 55 and older folks which stayed with trump (52%, down from 62% in 2016).
My question to them is exactly what did Trump do:
He crashed the economy, which we are finally recovering from
He allowed 400,000 innocence to die because he was ignorant and stubborn
He violated every code of ethical conduct
He profited and committed crimes while in office
And finally
He called for a violent insurrection against the peaceful transfer power after a free and fair election
The only way to honor the sacrifice of our soldiers is to make sure Trump and no one like him ever holds office again
🎯
It is literally the LEAST we can do from our armchairs.
What’s so sad is he did absolutely nothing for anyone with any connection to the military, active or veteran. He did manage to screw with the VA by installing 3 of his mal a lardo friends though. I’m afraid De Nile is deep in the forces I fear.
As a veteran, Don-old Drumpf’s vitriolic and narcissistic ignorance no longer angers me. It heightens my hyper vigilance to the degree needed in order to see he is only emblematic of too many amongst us unable to understand what selfless service is about. It’s sad…sad in a way where I am grateful more of my years are behind me than ahead of me.
I have the same experience with some people who are the true patriots and heros of this Nation.
They blindly support Trump and say almost verbatim
"I don't like what he says or how he acts but he is what our country needs"
I say don't you see You are the hero not him YOU are the true Patriot not him.
I then get either anger or the same answer as above.
So I say to myself" I " will restack repost donate get the message out write postcards for them and for this nation because they are truly misled.
Makes me so angry of how he takes such advantage of their love for their country with his lies
The current Repugnant Party is a cancerous lesion on our Democracy. A Minority of leaders are morons...the rest cowards to yellow to stand up for what's right. Which is worse????
Defund & dissolve the Republican party.
They did it in 2016.
I am a Goldstar family and I can tell you that a lot of viewers of Fox News have no idea that Trump has said one nasty word about the military. And they certainly do not believe me when I try and explain to them all the different things that he has said over the years. I even point out the different voting records of Republicans in the House and the Senate, but again this is not a well-informed population I think due to their viewing habits. Just my take on things.
Correct, I went to FoxNews.com and of course there is nothing on the site about Donny Dumpʻs comment. Time to buy up air time in cities and towns with military bases and roll the tape.
Some day there will be a reckoning for the damage Fox News has inflicted on this country by enabling and promoting Trump. An $800 million defamation settlement apparently was not nearly enough.
Time to revoke Murdoch’s citizenship and deport him as an enemy alien.
We can only hope. Fox News had the attention of too many Americans. It is responsible for the dumbing down of this Country. Misinformation needs to go away.
Fox News has and had the attention of too many of our citizens. It is past the time for the citizens of this country to demand that Congress update and reinstate the media's Fairness Doctrine.
Why don't we have a class action lawsuit against Fox News for destroying our country? I guess it's not gonna do anything until we just assign a dollar value to our loss democracy then maybe they will listen to us? A girl can dream. They are destroying our country, every day.
What you need to do, what Adam a GenZer, (he has a YT page, IG, Twitter, TikTok, Discord, Subreddit) does, at Trump rallies when talking to supporters, show them clips of DonOldJTrump saying these things. Some have had no comment, others “I didn’t know that”. Video visuals help. Of course, there will be those that say, it’s AI, or fake. But at least they’ve seen it.
Yeah, sure, ok. Maybe so, but it goes way deeper than what they see and hear on tv or the internet. They probably have no idea how the government works or think because he says it, it must be true without any evidence. It’s what Stanley Milgram wanted to find out in his “Obedience to Authority” study. He wanted to know why people did or believed what Hitler said. They did because they did. It’s why we tap our brakes when we’re driving and see a black and white in the vicinity. It’s hard for me to break it down without sounding like I’m rambling. Basically, we believe in some persons in positions of power and once we’re emotionally involved, we can’t be told otherwise. Also, the Stanford Prison experiment or Stockholm Syndrome. It’s tough for some to break away from their beliefs, no matter how harmful those beliefs may be to either themselves, their loved ones or society at large, even when presented with cold, hard facts or scientific evidence. Please try not to judge ME by what I’m saying. I’m simply trying to explain why some people love the Mango Mussolini and believe every word he says. I’m not one of them. I’m also a veteran and I was with Hillary when she said he and his cronies are deplorables.
An accurate take in my opinion!!!
I remember when he disparaged John McCain for being captured. Later at one of his rallies a reporter interviewed attendees including ones wearing caps or other indications of military service. They didn’t care. A couple laughed it off. One said McCain had done the wrong thing (ACA thumbs down). I knew we were in trouble then, 2015.
I think it is partly not wanting to know & being stuck in their ways. Younger veterans and enlisted service members think differently than those 55 and older. In 2016 veterans favored trump (60%-34%). In October 2020 it was 52%-42%. Enlisted service members leaned toward Biden.
I’m a member of VoteVets and financially support their efforts. Rachel Madow has aired some of their anti trump commercials. Cadet Bone Spurs is and has always been a disgrace and should NEVER be C in C again. We were lucky enough to make it through four years, let’s not press our collective luck with more!
I grew up in a military family. My father and his brothers were military. My mother's father and her brother were military. I lived near military bases My entire life. I was taught to love this country.
My father in law was a retired Navy Captain. When he passed away, he had a military funeral.
Everything I have ever heard about Trump disgusts me. I don't know how anyone who knows anything about the military could ever vote for him.
Thank God for you and your family’s legacy of service! ⭐️👏
There are many more that have your back. Keep spreading your story Teresa! There's an army out here doing more than you know, because we recognize the sacrifice of people like your family.
I forgot to mention that my brother and my sin also served. My son was in Iraq. I'm terrified for his children, if Donald Dump is elected.
This U.S. Army veteran will proudly cast my vote for Kamala Harris, Tim Walz and all D candidates up and down ballot in this election. Cadet bone spurs, Shady Vance , Mike Johnson and all the other election deniers are the biggest threat to our democracy. FWIW - former R (until RayGun) turned I and now solid D. Time to save America and the middle class. Vote BLUE.
I hope so, but with Fox playing so much on bases, it may be that military members and their families do not know
Indeed, so many voters are effectively shielded from earth-based reality by relying on Fox and sympathetic FB and X screed, believing that to leave that bubble they’ll be infected by actual facts.
I'm sure that you are correct. Such a gigantic shame...
So is that the Default station on the bases? Is it subsidized by Fox?
Like it used to be in Drs offices, clinics, hospital waiting rooms. Now I see HGTV instead.
Sadly, I think this is going to be the military equivalent of "I could shoot someone on 5th Avenue..."
If the McCain comments, the belittling and harassment of the Kahn Gold Star family, and saying "what was in it for them" at the grave site of John Kelly's son, in Kelly's presence didn't do it, this won't either. Salute to all veterans and most especially the recipients of the Medal of Honor, and all awards for heroism.
Only the grunts support the Demented One. . . Repugs attract mindless followers of orders—stupid people who think might makes right.
He must be reminded he must be told and informed over and over again of how much this nation continues to need his voice!
I heard what former President Trump said yesterday on the news. I sat stunned on the sofa for quite a while. His words about our Vets cast a continuing theme over the years. He is a very damaged unwell man who should never return to the White House under any circumstances.
Great words: “He is a very damaged unwell man who should never return to the White House under any circumstances.”
He should never have been allowed to go free. J6 he should have been arrested and charged with insurrection and treason as well as being responsible for lives lost that day. LIFE IN PRISON
And I mean arrested THAT DAY
Spot on, Janine! Yes, THAT DAY! No deference, no quibbling, just charged as a traitor. And for anyone who isn't clear on the terminology:
TREASON - "The betrayal of allegiance toward one's own country, especially by committing hostile acts against it...
The offense of attempting to overthrow the government of the state to which the offender owes allegiance,..."
- American Heritage
Dictionary
Cheeto Benito meets both these parts of the definition.
He should have never been allowed the first time
If members of the military, active duty or veterans, pay attention, they should notice that republicans actively fight against legislation that would help them.
If only they did pay attention.
WE are paying attention and WE have the power to change this, even if we are the underpower civilians. A simple disagree at a party, which I was at last night and they were questioning Kamala's "DEI" hire. And I couldn't stay quiet. No drama, just a couple facts, and then I walked away. Mustard seeds go farther than we think.
Easier said than done when raised and living in the monastic enclave of an “Apolitical” environment - which is exactly what our armed forces are. More of a concern is why the MAGA base rally attendees don’t see this? Veterans over all only comprise 18% of our population. One percent of our population serves on active duty…mostly in red states. And with the rapid operational tempo of fighting the forever wars and “conflicts” chosen by our legislators and taxpayers, little time remains to really understand any political parties agenda.
If he hasn't, then I can't comprehend what the heck is going on with Veterans in the U.S. BTW, I will always remember General Milley's comment to Michelle Obama at President Biden's swearing it. She said something to the effect that, "I'll bet you're glad that's over." He said, "You have no idea." Also, do I remember correctly that during this "campaign", the orange sadist called for the execution of Gen. Milley for being a traitor?
I am eternally grateful to General Milley for all he had to endure on our behalf! Without vets like him, Esper, etc., remaining in their trump admin assignments trying to contain a clueless maniac, I’m not sure where we’d all be today! Putin’s troops might have been invited to take over some of our military bases because, you know, “there’s fine people on both sides!”
(different application but still fits)
I can't agree with you more! Do you remember how, after the orange sadist lost the election, Gen. Milley as Head of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, sat the others down and said, "You take your orders from ME, now. If you get an order from the President, run it by me first." Astounding! And, as you say, he probably (sounds extreme, but I believe it) saved us from a nuclear war. Apparently when a war starts, often the President stays in power at the beginning.
Of thanks for that reminder! Absolutely nauseating that such a fool was ever elected president and unbelievable what his staff had to endure. Wish General Milley was still in service but he definitely deserved to retire!
Yes, he did. I can't think of anyone in recent times who has done more to protect our nation than General Milley.
I was probably too big of a fan lol. Used to tell my son to track Gen Milley down at the Army/Navy games to get a photo with him, but it never happened. Maybe one day?
That's a wonderful story! Was your son in the military?
Right. That's why accused criminal Netanyahu won't stop the war in Gaza, no matter how many children, women, doctors, and innocents are killed, wounded or starved. We would get ourselves the same thing if we allow the orange creature back into the WH
For General Milley's sake, I'm glad he was never (as far as we know) put in the position of having to choose between the C-in-C and his country.
I agree wholeheartedly.
His are not " politically motivated" statements.
This is who he has always been.
On Nov 6th 2020 he claimed that all votes received and counted after election day were illegal. That INCLUDED military votes that came in from overseas.
He doesn't not only give a shit about the military he has denigrated them for decades.
He likes the parades, the uniforms, the tanks and the weapons. The violence of war feeds his sadism.
He is the most loathsome creature on the planet.
If they keep voting for him at this point especially all I can say is they not only shame themselves but the entire country they profess to love and be willing to sacrifice their lives for.
👏⭐️ Wow! Some really great viewpoints on this thread. Harris/Walz needs to hire many of you to aid their campaign!! There should be commercial and billboards with quotes like this:
“He likes the parades, the uniforms, the tanks and the weapons.
(BUT HE DOESN’T LIKE YOU)!
The violence of war feeds his sadism.“
Thank you
You’re right, these statements are mostly unscripted stream of consciousness and tangential thinking. The man is clearly on the throes of dementia. He is nearly unable to make plans, carry out plans, change plans when circumstances change, or control his emotions to accomplish his goals. His prefrontal cortex is overshadowed by his amygdala- fear and anger, fight/flight/freeze. It’s horrific to think he could have almost total immunity when he is functioning like a toddler
Hey jd vance or whatever name you are using now, your 🍊hitler, felon, adjudicated rapist is the one w/STOLEN VALOR here. Quit being so damn nasty!
“It’s that Donald Trump hates Veterans and their sacrifice, because he looks so small in comparison to them.” This says it all. Veterans who still support the candidate on the right needs to wake up. Read Project 2025 regarding veteran benefits and health care.
Veterans are another part of the fabric that makes America. We were all civilians when we went into the military, and even the lifers come out as civilians again. I do not believe we vote as a block - it's just another demographic. So many vets, especially from the Vietnam era, were drafted, and most of them were drafted from the same demographic - lower middle class - which is the MAGA base, so many vets will continue to support the MAGA agenda. The important thing is that most Americans understand the difference between a Medal of Honor winner and little donny, so I would say that most Americans are really increasingly sickened by this idiot and his spawn, which includes JD.
Excellent points! 👏⭐️
Who knows? His support from the “law and order” folks never made sense, except for the fact that there must be so many in that community who are also sociopathic.
When I did my Psychiatry residency, I remember learning that 50% of police are sociopathic; the other 50% are truly good people. (Ditto ministers!)
Kdsherpa: do you have a source for that? I really really want to learn more about this! TIA
I wish I did. It was during one of my seminars during my fourth (out of five) year of residency. The professor who gave the lecture was studying CT scans of sociopaths versus normal people. He had done a lot of research in the area, and I guess was reporting on his (and those of researchers in other major institutions) findings. This was ages ago -- as in 35+ years ago -- so I don't know if these findings would still be valid as of 2024. I also recall that there was a fascinating finding that sociopathy appeared to be genetic to some degree. I've always thought that that fits exactly with the drumpf generations: his PGF, his father, himself, and his sons. (Grandchildren's personalities/personality disorders are yet to be seen.)
kd - a friend of mine, who's done a lot of tech work for local police stations over the last few decades, calls it, "cop mentality." He says he can spot it a mile away. This friend knew my father-in-law, who was a patrolman for 25 years (his not-so-secret drinking prevented any promotions), and said FIL was a perfect example. All I can say is, FIL was a total piece of work. I never wanted to be anywhere around him.
That's very interesting!
Go figure. And here I thought they all were CEOs and GOP politicians.
Well, them too -- only more like 90% sociopaths!
Good number! After Trump showed up and made pathological behavior " normal", it certainly seems like sociopathy is transmissable!
LOL!
Medal of Honor recipients, all military members, present and past, should know a grateful nation honors each and every one of you. A little, little man cannot tarnish our respect for you.
I wonder why Vance “retired” from the USMC? He’s been complaining about Tim Walz’ service, calling his “early” exit from the National Reserve almost an act of cowardice. The reserved armed forces of all of the branches is the backbone of our military forces. They’re ready to provide support wherever needed and constantly train to do so. How long did Vance serve? Why did he join in the first place? And what were his motives? The two people heading the Republican ticket have disgraced themselves with the military community, both active and retired, and there’s no reason to believe they’ll stop doing this. Trump cannot stop himself. Vance doesn’t want to!
Right! That “early exit” after 25 years of service!
Vance served four years and while in Afghanistan he worked in the Press Office
He was eligible to retire after 20 years and requested to stay another 4. That doesn’t sound like an early exit to me.
I don’t know why any veteran ever would ever have voted for Donnie Convict, but if anyone still does at this point, I submit they need professional help, fast. There is just no excuse after the bone spurs, all the denigrating comments, and the promise to basically turn the military into his own personal police force. Anybody who can rationalize all that is losing his grip on reality.
A pandemic an insurrection all the fault of Trump I watched that insurrection live. HE is an INSURRECTIONIST a BETRAYER and justice needs to be SERVED
Really? This guy for commander-in-chief? This loathsome, psychopathic narcissist who sees everything on the transactional basis of how it can best serve him? This horrible specimen of humanity who pours scorn on men of honor while sucking up to fascists? The idea is so laughably absurd that in a sane world it would be beyond imagination. But here we are: this is the world we live in.
But where are the generals who served in the White House with this monster? We need Milley, Mattis and Kelly to step forward together to denounce this traitor in the clearest terms.
Dear Generals, if you mean to uphold the oaths you took to our Constitution, it is your duty to speak up now in order to save our nation from an unmitigated disaster that would have the gravest consequences for the whole world, and for generations to come. Or would you rather be complicit?
They have spoken publicly. But I agree this would be a good time to do so again in a combined and focused way.
Exactly, Steven. It's one thing for them to voice their frustrations separately and, as they have tended to do, in terms that are somewhat oblique to the immediate danger at hand. Here, for example, are General Milley's words during his farewell speech: "We don’t take an oath to an individual. We take an oath to the Constitution, and we take an oath to the idea that is America, and we’re willing to die to protect it."
As you say, they need to speak up now in a combined and focused way to denounce Trump in clear and unvarnished terms. They need to do so in plain words that even the most diehard of MAGA cultists will understand.
There are groups of retired Flags that are speaking out and are actively working to support the Harris candidacy. You will be seeing more of us as the campaign moves forward.
And Thank YOU for your service!!!
General, The military man we most need to step forward is John Kelly. Not denying a report in The Atlantic about what Trump said about soldiers who gave their lives is NOT enough. By not speaking out, Kelly is allowing voters to put that guy back in the WH despite how dangerous he KNOWS trump is. If your group can sway Kelly to do what's right, it would carry a lot of weight in the eyes of the public.
THANK YOU, General Halter.
Thank you General Halter for this positive update!!!!!!
Thank you! Also realize that project 2025 calls for the military to swear allegiance to the president, not the constitution. The military currently can disobey an order that is against the constitution, but that wouldn’t be true under project 2025.
YESSSSS!!! THIS!!!!!!
My dear friend was a Vietnam veteran and died a painful death several years ago from Agent Orange related cancer. I donate to several veterans’ organizations and I have great respect for our veterans: several of my college classmates were drafted. I don’t know how the right wing will respond to Trump’s latest atrocious assault on our veterans, but I hope ALL veterans realize he has no respect for their service and is an abhorrent individual who should never serve as Commander in Chief.
Thank you all for your thankful comments. We appreciate your support!
I doubt trumps support from the military and vets will drop too much. The older Vets, may finally have heard enough. But as we’ve seen, if the are in the cult of Trump, they’ll find an excuse to dismiss his cowardly and appalling remarks.
The problem is half of our population doesn't hear about any of this.
Agreed 💯
Now if we could only get Fox "News" channel turned off at military facilities that have it on all day....
Women despise him veterans despise him and anyone with a brain despises him it's about 20 years past when he should have retired
It sickens me every time I hear what comes out of donOLD's mouth, but when he denigrates our Veterans, that's the last straw. This man is not fit to be President or hold ANY seat in Government, business or any position of power. He needs to punished for all the harm he's done to the American people and the World. Excellent piece today,Steven, Thank You 💯💙🇺🇸
USAF, 1965-1969. Trump lost me at the bone spurs. And every other denigration of the military and wounded vets since. This just makes me loath him even more.
Nothing new. Fox is a perpetrator of abuse against elders and those who easily buy into their narrative. Foxers don't trust anyone but Fox, so they aren't seeking out information. As my ever gullible brother told me - Google suppresses the truth and Fox keeps them informed. My family members who buy into the Fox narrative are either old, extremely gullible or delusional.
Some of my family members are overdosed on Fox news it's awful.
I once told a Trumper about the “suckers and losers” statement and he told me it was lie made up by the mainstream media. Theyve been brainwashed to not believe anything except Fox so there’s no way you reason with them. They’ll never see the horrible things Trump has said about the military from Fox..
You need to find a video clip of him saying that or Kelly saying DonOld said it, and show it to him.
I was a military wife for all of my adult years until the death of my husband. He died due to service on submarines. I am fighting for all military families when I spread the word about Trump! We must not let him EVER be commander in chief!
I am amazed Trump wins so many veterans' votes. I certainly hope his continued denigration of veterans, especially those who gave their all, will finally persuade veteran voters and their families that Trump is unfit to be commander in chief. This latest incident in which he tried to elevate a woman who's done nothing to deserve any medal, above actual heroes only makes his conduct that much more deplorable.
It's true that Fox News is by far the biggest proselytizer of the MAGA cult religion. And it's true that it is the mind and heart junk food of many who rarely dip into any true news to feed their minds. But I have to ask, even so, where is the mainstream media on reporting this? Why are they not supporting veterans and all the troops? You would think reporting these outrageous and sickening Trump comments as per the latest example, and exploring it journalistically, would get clicks and generate income (since that matters so much more than journalism in today's business model). Why are they essentially silent? It is beyond comprehension to me that those who have served would support the bone spurs draft dodger. (After 24 years, Tim Walz had every right to retire whenever he chose. Ironically, to continue his public service even til now. His length of military duty is the exception not the rule.)
There is a fairly long article on this in today's Washington Post.
on what?
On trump's comment about the Medal of Honor.
How is it that Fox is purportedly the most widely viewed television in common areas on military bases?
Anyone?
The extent to which Americans have gone to support their patron saint of self-righteous anger, cunning and deceit is at times stomach turning and mind boggling.
I’m not an American but I have stood on the deck of the USS Arizona memorial and wept, watching the oil still seep up from the ship beneath the water. I have been to that poignant cemetery at Omaha Beach three times and each time I feel the emotional weight of the thousands buried there and the honour and respect shown by visitors.
Trump's comments are outrageous, especially for someone who held the office of Commander-in-Chief.
It is customary to salute the holders of the Congressional Medal of Honor. It is not lightly won. Trump's actions and statements are no salute to those who wear the medal, and those who gave their lives in service of their nation.
America's servicemen and women have a proud heritage and we in the Western world value their efforts and devotion to duty.
Britni
We are a country of Red, White, and Blue! We are proud of our grandfather's, brothers and countryman who served! We have parades for them. Light off firecrackers and have fun family get-together! Of course, Donald hates this. He's not the center of attention and it reminds him he's a coward. It also reminds him of all the hurtful remarks he's made about the real American heros. Also, disrespectful J.D. has the makes disparaging remarks about another veteran. How respectful is that character?
Donald Trump is a gutless coward who avoided military service by obtaining a false medical report that claimed he had bone spurs. He is a weak, thin skinned, fear oriented bully who wants to become a fascist dictator. He is a national disgrace and an international embarrassment who attempted a coup on Jan. 6, 2021, and refused to return Top Secret documents from his home in Florida. He also attempted to overthrow the results of the presidential election in Georgia. He has no respect for the rule of law, the Constitution or The Bill of Rights, and deserves to be in a federal prison for the heinous crimes he has committed against this country. As an 85 year old honorably discharged U. S. Navy veteran of the Vietnam Era, I cannot imagine why any active duty or military veteran would vote for this very sick and dangerous individual. After Trump loses the election on Nov. 5th, the new Harris/Walz administration needs to quickly move forward with prosecuting, convicting and sentencing this THUG to a Federal prison where he should remain for the rest of his life. Trump is nothing but a treasonous traitor!
Amen!
Convict Trump's remarks about the Medal of Honor were truly reprehensible. Whether it is military veterans, civil servants of any type or virtually anyone else, he does not understand the concept of country above self. He doesn't understand that the classified documents in his bathroom were obtained through someone else's sacrifice. It means nothing to him. He is not running to serve his country. He is running to enrich himself and to stay out of prison. Sadly, I don't think the MAGA cult cares. If it mattered, a convicted felon would not be on the ballot.
This latest comment won't change a thing with the MAGA Veterans, just like p****y grabbing did nothing to erode the MAGA "Christians" support for Trump.
Lord, I hope so. Nothing is more abominable than anyone denigrating our Servicemen & women. Stuck in the 70--80s (his ties, suits etc0, ole burn spurs needs to find a hole and crawl in. I have said it before, we must turn-out and vote in numbers so large there is NO question about the outcome. Steven, thanks for letting us vent.
Trump has continually been going down from a moral standing point of view from even before his presidency and is still going down and there seems to be no bottom in sight yes. The main surprise is that the MSM, the GOP and a lot of Americans, keep on following him in his downward spiral by lowering their own standing This no doubt will have a longer-term impact on the moral standing of the US as a country.
I hope so.
I think those who support Trump will support him no matter what. I live in a 55+ community. Every Friday my neighbor hosts a “men’s attitude adjustment” gathering and all the attendees are veterans. The oldest among the group is so diehard a trumper that nothing, not even this most-recent despicable bit, will change his mind. It’s unfortunate that their disdain for more-liberal minded folks has blinded them to the reality of Trump (unless they, too, are utterly vile humans).
I've listened and read literally thousands of posts of vets, from my era ('Nam) all the way to today. And I'm still gobsmacked that ANY veteran who took the oath to protect and defend the Constitution would vote for Trump or any MAGA candidate. The reasons are long, but really., why would you vote for:
-- a draft-dodger?
-- someone who disrespects vets -- esp. those that get killed or "hit with bullets." Are you ephing kidding me?
--someone who doesn't understand the military and doesn't want to learn. THIS is the guy you want as you CiC?
--someone who doesn't understand or respect the Constitution?
--someone who couldn't be bothered to go to the Normandy beaches and cemetery to honor the brave men and women (incl. my uncle) who made the ultimate sacrifice?
--someone who only gives orders to please or benefit himself?
--someone who loves and cherishes his relationships with people who would be (or actually are) our enemies?
If you vote for Trump or MAGA -- even if the MAGA candidate running was a vet him or herself -- then you've lost your way and your credibility...just like those MAGA vets.
Brian Mast empretzeled himself defending trumps comments this morning. There’s no self respect left in that party. None.
Props for, "empretzeled," Will. Love it!
We already know he's an asshole. Now, would you mind writing about the bribe Egypt paid him just before he took office? The corruption is just breathtaking yet you, like the rest of the news media, focus on his stupidity instead of his criminal acts.
It is hard for me to see how any veteran could support this man who has time and time again mocked and disrespected these people.His evading military service to Viet Nam because of imaginary “ bone spurs” because he was wealthy enough to $ get a doctor $ to exempt his service is a cowards way out.I will continue to be be perplexed at veterans who support him as well as women,people of color,and other groups that he has belittled and mocked and continues to do so to this day.
I think veterans who saw battle and are thinking people, understand what a repugnant jerk Trump actually is. I think all military who take their jobs seriously and understand their role in relation to this country understand Trump is undeserving and should never have been president and should be prevented from being so ever again. Like every class of Americans though, there are people who were in service and are in service who see that service differently. Maybe they like the machismo (men and women by the way) or who were incapable of seeing the people in countries who suffered massively because of the US thirst for war as less than human. Everyone knows folks like this. Sadistic, violent, no regard for the humanity of others that they can overpower. Those vets stay with trump because they are wired the same way. They were wired that way before going into the armed forces. They never had honorable intent. Military service doesn't by itself make someone a hero or worthy of the statement "thanks for your service." Those folks....they won't be like Milly who stands in the way of a trump who will brazenly use the military for his own autocratic putinesque ends. Trump is counting on it and that is who he is signaling to. A dictator needs a military comprised of monsters.
I saw an interview with retired General McCaffrey on Deadline Whitehouse. He stated that even with everything that has happened, there’s still a certain percentage of the military who support trump - which I find completely baffling. And Sad! They haven’t just overlooked one thing he’s said or done, but multiple things. 🙄
Saw it also; Jack Jacob's 2 quotes nailed it esp; "...if I am only for myself, what am I?" We probably all have answers for that...
I great he gives the richest foreign woman in Earth a praise or award for keeping more vulnerable Americans strung out on a drug worse than heroin ,a drug she makes more money off of ,keeping them in poverty housing and on food stamps instead of rehabilitating them. Their families only receive the help if they stay in the state ran programs making her richer ,the state richer and the poor families watch as their lived ones slowly die from organ failure ...methadone numbs the organs . Over time the anus protrudes until eventually they have to start removing it or they can't sit . Their tongues swell up until they can't talk... They would have been way better off had they continued with heroin . And yet , give the witch a medal as she oversees more and more American families in disrepair. For the money she gets the family should use it for rehabilitation and treatment . Not her dysfunctional drug
Sadly, it doesn’t seem to change their minds. I posted about this latest insult on my high school friend’s page. I got an indignant response from one of her friends who defended him and said that I need to stop getting my news from CNN (as if!). She said she and her whole military family were ardent supporters and insisted that “most military” do support him. I then pointed out that she was incorrect and that many do not. Later my friend found an article that defended bone spur deferments as very common (yeah, I guess they were, if your dad could afford them). Nope, some are just in too deep. Yet I am heartened to read the numbers have gone down some.